ICPA Recap

Machine Operated Script:

Michelle Frennier  

I panic is more expensive than patience. Have you ever heard more Truer words than that right now? Like everyone panics, everyone’s getting like, their hair up, oh my gosh, what’s happening? And really, it’s a game of patience before

Annik  

we get started with the show. Here’s a quick word from our sponsor, global Training Center. As trade compliance professionals. You want to make sure that your procedures and documentation are completed as correctly as possible to avoid any delays and possible fines, we provide a range of trade compliance courses that will fit your needs, from in person or web training to recorded on demand courses we can train one or even 1000s on your team through your learning platform or on our portal, we can even customize a private session for your team. Go to globaltrainingcenter.com to find out more.

Andy  

Hey folks, we’re ready for another recording here at simply trade podcast. It has been a good time for several folks that we’re going to be talking today about a conference that I did not get to go to. I’m like, upset with myself that I couldn’t do it and Lalo you, if folks just let them know, Lalo has kind of rubbed it in my nose a little

Lalo  

bit. There’s no way I would do that.

Andy  

No, it’s seriously, it’s it was guys. So what was it like? I mean, from what I understand, well, this year’s icpa conference. That’s international compliance Professionals Association, for those that may be just listening for first time with us, but icpa conference, this is, like, a record attendance. Was it not? Yeah,

Lalo  

it was this year was I mean, they every year, they say the same thing and we say the same thing, but this year again, they did break their own record. Of course, when you’re a sponsor or an exhibitor, you tend to miss on other stuff, like Michelle off camera, we were talking about how she missed some of the sessions, and how glad she is not to take away her thunder. I don’t know if this is what she was going to talk about. Going to talk about, but icpa tends to record, not tends to but does record the whole event, and you have access for it to the sessions, even though you didn’t attend. So at another icpa event and and so we have Michelle for near and the way she explained it, Michelle, you tell me what you want to say where you’re from, because you gave me two or three different entities. So I don’t know which one you want to represent at this show, but thank you so much for coming on. But she in general, she’s a consultant that knows a lot about trade, so

Michelle Frennier  

about a few things. So yes, I am complicated, but I do have my own compliance business under evolution trade solutions, so that is what I operate under. But I also do some fractional work for a few people that you guys know very well. I work with Bonnie Kirsch at Magnolia trade solutions. I’m part of her team for fractional help with great I think we complement each other quite well. It’s been wonderful to work with her. And I also do some work in the tech space, doing consulting on global trade specifically for NMB solutions, who does Microsoft specific integrations. So kind of a niche thing, but tapping into my tech background that I really love that’s a space that I’m just near and dear having been licensed for 20 years this year. What how I was nine years old when I got my license? I

Andy  

was just gonna say probably were only about nine or 10 when you got it, then exactly,

Michelle Frennier  

and you were sticking to that. So yeah, 20 years license. So I do have quite a background of all over the place, a bit of a trade unicorn. I take that. Well, yeah, thanks for having me. Guys. Hey,

Andy  

folks, listen, we’re gonna have Michelle’s contact information with part of the show notes. And, you know, as we’re going through, reach out to Michelle, you know, hit on LinkedIn and as well. But if you have questions, whatever you know she can point you in the right direction. If it’s not something she can handle herself. But yeah, Michelle’s you’re such a pleasure to be around. I’m telling you. It’s like, Michelle, I’ve just noticed that, and I can remember it. It’s like, when you walk in, it’s like, Sunshine just all of a sudden in through the window. It’s like, it’s really cool. Everybody enjoys being around you so, and you know your stuff. So that’s, that’s cool. That’s

Michelle Frennier  

the bonus, right? It’s done. It’s not a flaky conversation. I hope, that’s what I hope. Yeah, so the conference was bonkers. So many people. I’ve never had to text somebody to find out where to sit down for lunch. I mean, room was a sea of people. It was, it was crazy. So walking in being like, straight back, straight back, what side? I mean, the place was monstrous. There was, what, 1000 people in person. Yeah,

Lalo  

they were, they were serving lunch for now. 900 plus, 950 plus people is like, holy smokes, you know, and, and, and the funny thing is that I always say this about icpa Man, their meals are delicious. And it was like, how do they do that for 900 plus people? You know, it’s crazy. So, of course, Disney, yeah, exactly. Disney magic. There. They had a, they had a, what’s his name, ratatouille cooking back there, going, going hard at it.

Andy  

Well, the end, the thing out of all of that too, is, is, it’s the snacks in between the meals too, that get you. Is, like, you know, if you go to icpa conference, you’re going to gain a few pounds

Michelle Frennier  

everywhere, and do you have to walk? We’ve

Andy  

already said it was big. What about the exhibitors? Were there a lot there. There

Michelle Frennier  

were so many and so many in the tech space. I had done us a summary. Every Friday morning I send out my global compliance supply chain recap. Call it the evolution. I know, totally tacky, but one of the thoughts that I have is trade automation spotlight that I do every week. And I decided, because there were so many tech companies who were sponsoring and exhibiting, I was like, Well, man, I’m just gonna light them all up. So I grabbed all their logos and tossed them into my template and said, Here are all the people you can talk to. So if you’re in a space where you’re trying to learn about what’s going on, all again, all the materials, if you attended the conference, are all on the web app for, I believe, like, 60 days or something. I might be misquoting that, but an extended amount of time, so you can go and check out all of those different people, especially if you didn’t get a chance to stop in yourself. And of course, they do the thing where you go around and you get your thing signed so that you can enter into drawings. And all of that is just a great way to network see who’s on the on the market, but it’s definitely not all the people. You remember, there’s so many new people coming in and bringing their services to to the people. So it was a good year to be there in person for that. There was a lot of great examples.

Andy  

Make a point to go by and check out every one of the exhibitors that are there, and especially icpa is great. But any of the conferences you need to check them out, even if your company or your department does not necessarily have a need for that company service at the time you may have a need. And you go, you know what? I talked to XYZ, and that may be a good place for us to, you know, come back around. So what do you think about that? Michelle,

Michelle Frennier  

well, they might be your boss too someday, right? Oh, there you go. Yeah, no, I think that’s the that’s the beauty of the what we do. And I feel like, with my background, there’s no other better example than showing from working in brokerage to in house compliance to tech companies that do compliance and software solutions, back forth, back forth. There’s tons of opportunity to meet people, and you do find yourself pulling on those folks. I know I had a wonderful time meeting up with vendors in the tech space, people that I got to meet with in person, the European teams at some of these companies who otherwise wouldn’t be in an in person. I’d be over zoom and, you know, it’d be early in the morning to connect with them, but we had great time just being able to catch up, talk that one specific thing that was harder to do over email, where you could touch base with them. I mean, in a small room, I was able to bop around and get all of these things done in a short period of time, learn about new technology, but also catch up with new faces old faces. So fun. It was a it was a really great time to network and put faces to names, especially in the LinkedIn world. You may interact with somebody all day long, all the time. You love their stuff, and all of a sudden you’re like, Wait, you’re that person. And I had a couple of instances where people recognized me and I was laughing. I was like, Well, I guess my putting myself out there worked. People recognized me. Must be my head shot. Looks enough like me that people come over and say, Hello. That’s always a worry, right? So

Lalo  

Michelle and I were trying to remember exactly what the what it is that happened right in the middle of the

Michelle Frennier  

conference. Came in hot from Canada. And it was, everyone was buzzing. The whole place went, like, did you hear that? Did you hear this? Did you hear this? And yeah, it

Lalo  

was Yeah. And then so everybody was talking about, yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah. It was funny, because all of a sudden, all the Canadian boots were gone. They were empty because they were dealing with their clients, panicking. Literally, we were sitting there. It was like, early, before noon, and everybody was gone from the Canadian boost, you know, like, Oh, my goodness. And we check our our messages. Oh, that’s why, you know, because that that’s when they hit, I think you’re right. It was a 50% terrorism on Canadian goods. And that was before the US, NCAA, you know. Override, I won’t call over right exemption was also allowed or whatever. But anyway, the

Michelle Frennier  

things that I guess I also want to make sure to take a moment out to talk about with you guys before we get too far into it, was that a standout for me about the sessions and how the conference runs, in general, there was a wonderful sponsor who we all know and love, Cindy Allen, who was supposed to be there and couldn’t be at the last minute. And I just wanted to really recognize sort of those MVPs that stepped in and just seamlessly made sure that the sessions she had planned went off without any sort of problems, and that, you know, trade force multiplier was still like, banner up as a sponsor, even though she couldn’t be there. So, you know, hats off to Amy Morgan and George Tuttle for picking up those sessions. They were really great. You know, it’s no fun to miss out, especially as a sponsor. So it was great that everyone sort of pulled in, and that’s really the family of icpa, like, I think that was happening, like, just like this. I was listening to the coordination, and all of a sudden, everything’s covered, and off they went. So, really great. Good

Lalo  

point real quick. And I was just, that’s a good point that you say that Michelle the family, that I want to emphasize that it’s funny because that they, when everybody, I mean, people, were there, of course, to listen to all the all the speakers, but that day when they found out that Cindy is not coming in, it’s like everybody knew everybody. It’s not like, who’s Cindy or or, or even if they didn’t know her personally, like we do you know, because we do know her quite personally. She’s an instructor for us and everything, you know, even if they don’t know him like that way, they know of her. And because it’s a big family, you know, it’s like, it’s my third cousin, you know, then, oh, darn, she didn’t make it to the party, you know. And what happened? People were genuinely concerned, what happened to Cindy, you know? So it was, it was great, and and I did, I’m with you, Michelle, kudos to Amy and George that stepped up and like they went off without a hitch, like you said.

Andy  

Icpa, you know, you just, it’s a it’s a family, as an Lister would say, it’s the family reunion you want to go to. You know? What do you see in the in these sessions here that would be, you know, was, I guess, really beneficial to you?

Michelle Frennier  

Yeah, great segue, because I had put together my top sessions, the ones that I just absolutely loved, and one of them was Pete mento. I don’t know if anyone caught that session in person, but I listened to it after the fact, because I was not in it, but the buzz around the place, it was just everyone, Uncle Pete. Uncle Pete had the words so to say what he said regarding your statement of what do you do and what happens when this is all moving, I wrote it down. Panic is more expensive than patience. Have you ever heard more Truer words than that? Right now, like, everyone panics. Everyone’s getting, like, their hair up, oh my gosh, what’s happening. And really, it’s a game of patience. I mean, I very rarely react to what’s going on until it’s the dust settles a little bit. I think you had a lot of conversations happening about that, people who whose anxiety levels were right through the roof. And I was like, Oh, I remember those days. I’m gonna talk to you a minute so that you will calm down. Because people will, like, leave these events like, thinking that their list of things they needed to do is so big and there’s no way they’ll ever cover it. And people get very, very nervous about what they hear. So it’s important to kind of scoop those people up at conferences and be like, just remember how far you’ve come. Write down the most impactful things to your business and who you’re going to talk to when you get back from from the sessions. Remember you have them recorded. Get the right people in the room. Schedule a session at home, sit everybody down in a conference room, or invite them through a teams meeting, whatever it might be, and sit down with the right people in your company to let them hear what you heard. It’s a wonderful opportunity to show off what you’ve learned. Why it’s important that you should be able to go to these because funding is a thing. A lot of people are having to cut back. And there’s conversations that happen in person that don’t happen virtually. Now, Lila Landis does an amazing job coordinating like the virtual network to make sure people feel like included. But it’s, it doesn’t replace that sort of side conversation you had with someone to help them out. Yeah. Pete session was absolutely it was absolutely crazy. He had some wonderful points. I suggest going back to look at it. It was the impact of global economy on trade, and he covered nuts to soup, everything that we’re seeing, along with some nuggets about things he’s hearing out there in the ether, you know, information from DC people he knows right enough to know that we we need to buckle up. Things aren’t over quite yet. So I always

Andy  

you know the just think of it with the. Soldiers in the foxholes. Sometimes you need to just keep your head down until the dust settles a little bit and then come back and say, Now, what do we do? You know, assess it there. Don’t, don’t jump too quickly. So

Michelle Frennier  

one of the other sessions that was just phenomenal was a panel discussion on key takeaways for like, you know, global trade like, is the future of IT technology. So they pulled in an amazing panel. And what I liked about it is nobody was like, pumping their own stuff up, hitting their chest, right? It was, it was all a really wonderful calling each each person out, saying, Hey, can you offer some information on that? And so the key speakers there, I had written them down here. So Jamie, untied from trabex, was on the call. She has an amazing background. I couldn’t remember the exact company she’d worked for previously, but she’s been around a long time, doing tech in the trade space. Also, David Moore, or Dave Moore from vigilant global trade, was on the panel, Todd Smith from kyg, of course, former KPMG, and Ted Lancaster from Alliance drawback. So those are the panelists, and Joe Burkes from vigilant, was the Speaker coordinator for that session, so he kept things moving. And what I loved about it was there were some really great conversations around trade data, and everybody wants to be doing something, but many of the challenges that are out there is messy data, and how do you handle that, and what do you do? So a lot of really great little nuggets and a kind of a fun fact, 65% of all of the trade technology automation is the house cleaning. It’s getting the data discovered and looked at. It’s not even deploying it. So it’s kind of crazy that 65% of the work is actually in the prep and that just under understanding your tech stack, right? Having due diligence, each one of us in trade has to start learning that these solutions are really in our space, and we are the human in the loop. We’re the people who say whether what we saw is legitimate or not, and it is part of the due diligence for us to do that check. AI is not going to take care of that. It’s not going to step in and do it all for us. Unfortunately, they still need us. They still need our dusty old broker’s licenses. We’re going to be good for a while. I think

Andy  

you don’t want to get bug bogged down in, you know, cleaning up data. It’s like you’ve got to get those processes fixed so that when there is a great opportunity for your company to flourish, maybe again, on us, exports and whatnot, that you’re focusing your expertise on, what it does, what it’ll be to make that reality and take advantage of an opportunity, versus you’re behind the eight ball and you’re constantly, you know, having to clean it up. So

Michelle Frennier  

having your house in order, having clean data, knowing how your goods are classified for export purposes, making sure that you have proper ECCN number, that you’re filing AES in the times when you should a little known thing that I think people forget to that happens is, I think it was 2020, there was an a signing of you need to file AES if your goods are have an ECCN number and are going to China, Hong Kong, Russia or Venezuela, regardless of value. And can you imagine, if your goods are, let’s say, a chip that was just generic. No big deal, right? No, it can just go E, R, E, A, R, 99 and then you realize that your engineers changed those chips, and now they have spicy chips, and not the salsa and the corn chip kind, the kind that have encryption and things that require you know, even if it is a low level ECCN number that sort of under the radar of needing licensing, you may need to file those AES filings, and what a bummer. If your website says your new technology and the export enforcement people kind of queue in that you haven’t been doing your job, right? So, yeah, that’s enough. Scary. I did have some other stuff kind of pulled aside. That was really great. There was a session on Wednesday, of course, the last day it’s so hard, there’s people traveling, right? Everyone’s got their suitcases with them, but some of the really good sessions happened on Wednesday as well, so definitely worth a watch back. But one of them that I really enjoyed participating in was getting a seat at the boardroom with Bonnie Kirsch was the speaker there. And, you know, such great shares things from corporate strategy to turning your compliance department into a bit of a revenue cost center, so bringing money back in the house, which is important if you’re in house, customs. People don’t realize that we don’t operate the same as other departments, but on the P and L, we can become, you know. I’ll align on them pretty quickly. And you know, of course, the basics on risk mitigation and how to build a team and how to really get the respect internally. So great, great session. There fun little story at the end. If you go back and watch it, we were all talking about how long it took us for our broker’s licenses to happen after we passed the test. And I won’t give it away on here. You have to go back and listen to it. But the way I got approved for my broker’s license was unconventional. Let’s just say that, hey,

Andy  

as we’re talking through this, I guess Lalo, I was going to ask you a question. Did you guys see a lot of questions, as far as people looking for, you know, training, obviously, on the different topics, to help deal with, you know what was going on, as far as the you know how to get up to speed real fast, or was it more career move type training, or what? What’d you get?

Lalo  

We’ve had, we had two or three types of people approach us and on the training they’re wanting to look at, like the foundational type training, where, how is an import done, or how to do tariff classification, etc, you know, because those tend to just the foundation on doing transactions is pretty you know, it’s a base. I mean, you need to follow all these rules and procedures, etc. But then we had the other kind of group that would come up to us and say, Okay, I understand all that, but man, for me to this is a moving target, of course, and everybody’s probably tired of hearing that, because it’s so obvious. It’s the, you know, like, there’s that commercial to travel company, I guess, is kept in obvious, you know, because it’s very true, right? I mean, it’s, I mean, it’s obvious that everything is changing everything, and that everybody who needs to know, or wants to know, the problem that they have, that people approached me or Annick or Chris, you know, because all three of us were there, was we get webinars. You know, a lot. There’s a lot of information out there where people are coming to us and telling us, you know, this has changed. This is what, this is a new requirement, and this is what’s coming down, etc, whatever. The problem is that there’s really no heads down, like how to do it, you know. Okay, so there’s a, there’s a 25% tariff on on items coming in from Mexico, of course not right now. But you know, at the time those 25% tariffs coming in from Mexico, regardless of it being a usmca or not, you were still going to pay that 25% tariff or not? Okay at the time. Of course, remember people, I’m just talking I’m just giving examples. I know now if you’re 25% will go away if you’re not, if you are usmca, but the problem was that they didn’t know that. They didn’t. I mean, well, can you usmca? Well, why? Why am I even going to do usmca anymore? You know, it’s very confusing. So anyway, the nuts and bolts of what is coming down. Okay, now, you told me that I’m going to pay 25% tariffs, but there was no really nuts and bolts on how to get it done. You know that that usually requires two or three hour session versus a one hour informational session. So there a lot of the stuff that they were asking us was that, you know, like, Can is there training out there where I can attend? Unfortunately, these days, it might be a weekly training now, because things change so fast, but in general, is there something out there that I can learn so that I can push into my procedures, in my, you know, make some adjustments to my SOPs or whatever, so that I know that I am going to be doing things correctly according to today’s regulations. So, yeah, I mean, those are the kind of conversations we had. And what Michelle said was very as related to what Bonnie session is that was a third type of conversation. How do I get my upper management to understand that this is as serious as we need to, you know? Basically, get that seat in the table, right? You know? And we’ve been saying this a lot on the podcast. Sorry if I sound repetitive, but they say, the more you repeat it, the more people remember. But we, like recently, have been saying that you don’t have a seat in the table. You’re part of the menu. So, I mean, gotta, gotta get it done, right? I mean, so anyway, so yeah, those are the kind of conversations we had, from from folks looking on the trade side. You know, Michelle had a lot of good points on technology. There’s people looking for lots of help in technology as well. But anyway, so, yeah,

Michelle Frennier  

sort of so piggyback on that. A fact I heard during Pete Mentos presentation was sort of staggering, how many of us licensed for. Brokers like what the demographic is, and 50% of brokers right now are over the age of 50, and 10% of the brokers are 80 years old. So what you were hearing was probably a lot of younger folks coming up, asking questions, maybe people who aren’t licensed yet and want to be or are looking for ways to better their certifications and be employable with some of these extra credentials so that they can be taken seriously in the space and so forth. So absolutely, we need lots more training for everyone who wants it. We need to advocate for folks to take the test. I feel like that’s just not a strong enough force out there to say, Hey guys, it’s a wonderful career. If you have your license, you’re going to spring forward. You do need people in those spots who have those credentials, especially if you are going to try to apply technology, if you’re going to assign tariff classifications, that’s customs business, right? You need to be a licensed broker to be giving out full tariff classifications and so forth. So there’s a lot to be said for the training that leads up to that. Just getting people, sort of operators out there who are doing the good stuff and all the hard things. It starts at the lowest level of the company has the highest risk to brokers, right? The release staff, the people who are doing that first century, those people, I feel like there’s a upskill that should be happening earlier in the process, now that things are being kind of probably the most difficult it’s been in my career, at least.

Andy  

So then that would say 50% over 50 another 10% 80 and above, whatever. That’s a that’s a big chunk there. So what it means is those people will be retiring in about 10 years, some of them, some of them, you know, already going out. There’s a great career path. And so to your point is that gaining that, you know, fixing out, what is it that you need to do to develop yourself, become proficient and and develop those skills and and so that would be a great way to to look at it longer term, because if you can get your license now you’re in some of these entry level or mid middle level positions, you get your license and have sufficient, you know, another few years of experience now of a sudden, you qualify for some of the top leadership type positions. So, good point, Michelle,

Michelle Frennier  

and you don’t need to wait around. I got my license probably a year after starting customs brokerage from transportation, went to brokerage, realized working nights at the border was not a lot of fun, and that there was this lady who had day shift and she knew smart things that sat in the corner, and she was a licensed broker, and so I sort of DIY my own need for that training. I was like, I’m not going to wait for someone to open up that training to me through the company. I’m just going to go take this test. I’m going to do it. And I did, and I feel like there’s a path for that. The further you go, the sooner in your career, the better off you are. There’s no need to wait around for someone to swoop you under their wing. I mean, of course, it’s awesome to have, and I advocate for being mentored and and learning the today, but the test isn’t your every day. The test is just knowing where to find things when you’re working out in the ether. The way you get it done in practice is not on the test. So don’t be afraid of diving into the books on that.

Lalo  

As we said earlier, Michelle’s all her information and contact. I did learn that also, people love to check our show notes, so her information will be on there. You can reach out to her or to us, and, you know, we’ll, we’ll make the connection. It’s not a big deal. And don’t be afraid to reach out. Like several people said, I wanted to, I wanted to be on your show. But, you know, I just thought, maybe I shouldn’t come on. You can do it. You can. And we met our superfunder. Did you see him? Michelle, our superfan. He’s not even in trade. He’s not even in trade. He’s a husband, oh, he’s a boyfriend of one of the people who are in trade. And she’s, like, really high up in her company. They import automobiles from all over the very high end automobiles. But anyway, he was there. He had his own t shirt of Andy and the podcast, and he’s telling us his story and everything is awesome, guys. So we, we hope to get his clip up on LinkedIn so everybody can meet him. But he’s a really cool guy. So, but anyway, I mean, he just came up and says, Guys, I really love your show and everything. So anyway, I

Michelle Frennier  

got my Onyx sticker. That was my big one. I was like that. I was gonna say that about your booth earlier, that even if you stop by, you don’t get the hard sell, but you get to choose your favorite character of take home a sticker. Um, if you’re all over the tops of water bottles or on our on our notebooks, we carry you around with love.

Andy  

It is so humbling. Thank you so much for what you’re doing for our show. We just, it’s we’re so humbled by this and so thankful so to all of that. We’re just Thank you, Michelle, you’re wonderful. Once again, it’s just like you’re that ray of sunshine. It’s just so fantastic girl. Lalo, I missed it. Hopefully I’ll get to go on the next go around. I know I just got plans to do the Dallas show, so when it comes up,

Lalo  

yeah, we for sure need to do that one. So anyway,

Andy  

alright with that. Everybody. Have a great day. Thank you. Thank

Lalo  

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