How to Stay Sane (and Successful) When Trade Policies Keep Changing

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Annik  

Music Before we get started with the show, here’s a quick word from our sponsor, global Training Center. As trade compliance professionals, you want to make sure that your procedures and documentation are completed as correctly as possible to avoid any delays and possible fines, we provide a range of trade compliance courses that will fit your needs, from in person or web training to recorded on demand courses. We can train one or even 1000s on your team through your learning platform or on our portal. We can even customize a private session for your team. Go to globaltrainingcenter.com to find out more.

Andy  

Hey, folks, this is Andy shiles with Simply trade podcast, and it’s another great time. We’re gonna do a great show today. Today we’re going to get in and talk to a friend of mine, Bethany Seymour. Now, Bethany and I have met each other initially at the icpa conference, and she is in the compliance arena, and we have every time we get together, we laugh and talk, we get to cutting up on different things and almost get ourselves into trouble if we were sitting in a session. But anyway, Bethany, welcome to the show. Tell everybody who you’re working with and where you’re at now.

Speaker 1 

Hey everyone. Nice to meet you. I’m Bethany. I’m working right now with regal Rex Nord. We’re a multi national or global manufacturer of a bunch of parts that you never realized were ours, so you probably heard us and experienced us somewhere in your in your daily life, and be it in an air conditioner or conveyor or something that makes something else that you touch. So that’s where I’m at right now. But I am a licensed Customs broker also, so I’m feel pretty confident being able to speak to you. Andy, a little bit here we’ll see

Andy  

COVID. Listen, you. You’ll forget more than I’m going to learn probably. So you’re you’re really up. There we go. Well with that, the one of the things that with all this that’s going on, the changes that, the the threats of terrorists, the the accusations of, you know, China playing hardball again with certain things. There’s other countries that are supporting or trying circumventing some of the sanctions that are out there and all that kind of stuff. Bethan, let me ask you, how do you keep up this up to date with some of this is just like an information overload. There’s a lot of people, if you’re new to a department or an area, you may have been there for a while and going, you know, I need to do a better job of even trying to stay up to speed. And right now, you know, the last four years has been somewhat of a sleeper. Now, all of a sudden, it is like, oh my gosh, only three weeks into the new administration, and it is just like overload. How do you keep up to speed or keep your sanity? From your perspective, because I know I’m like floors, how

Speaker 1 

do you keep up to speed and how do you keep your sanity? Are two very different questions. That’s true. You know, the best way I found to keep up to speed. Number one, if you’re not signed up for us, customs, CSMs messages, get signed up. There’s, there’s no cost to them. Get signed up on them right now. Second best thing I tell you to do is go find some trusted trade lawyers. There’s many of them in the business who publish out, you know, regular newsletters and news blasts. I could name a few of them right now, if you’d like me to. I don’t want to leave anyone out, though, but there’s, there’s a number of firms, Braun Miller’s one, Sandler, Travis, Rosenberg, Foley, Hoag, Aiken, Gump, there’s a whole bunch, though. George

Andy  

Tuttle, whatever. Joe is a great guy.

Speaker 1 

George is my hero. George. George is my hero. So listen, and I know I’m leaving people out, but there’s, there’s many, many, many, many, many, and when stuff like this happens, and it’s, we’re not just talking when a new administration comes in, but when something changes in our business or in our world, your trade lawyers are the number one people who are going to help you get that information out, and they’re people you can trust. They’re not just random, you know, Joe Schmo over there, or Andy shiles Over there, sending you some some info. No, I just got to tease you a little Andy. But you know, get on their newsletters, get on their news blasts, and then when something happens, you’ll get that right away. When something comes across, then you can compare that information, save it to your folder. You can search it later on in your emails and pull it back up.

Andy  

Well, the newsletters are helping. And by the way, I’d be remiss if I didn’t say this global training center sends out, oh God, yep, a newsletter that is really, really good. A lot of times, some of the topics we’re talking about on these shows with simply trade, but then they cover several other things. But the point of the newsletter, you don’t necessarily have to read, you know, cover to cover and all that. You can scan through this newsletters if you see. See topics on several newsletters that seem to be hitting every one of them, you need to probably stop and go ahead and read the full article, but you can scan that stuff. Don’t think that you’re going to be able to digest everything. You just scan through a lot. You look at it if it’s pertinent to your industry, stop and read that one in more detail. But the other stuff, you can just scan over

Speaker 1 

and stick it folder. By the way, stick it in a folder because at some point you’re going to realize maybe that was pertinent to your industry and you didn’t know it at the time. But if you stick it in a folder and you search it, you find it, your email is going to be your friend there. So stick it in a folder somewhere. Don’t just delete it

Andy  

so you can come back and reference it. Well, I was just gonna say, as you’re going through that one of the things that I did now, you know, different companies and different functions that you did. I, when I in my FedEx days, we actually had an extremely large like regulatory affairs group, and so I had several employees. One of the departments I had was dealing with top importers and all that. And I had 21 professionals reporting to me. Of the 2118 were licensed brokers. So I had a big concentrate. I didn’t realize it at the time, but I had more licensed brokers than any other consulting firm in the country. But the other was the the regulatory affairs group that I took that over, and I wound up assigning my my staff, and look to see who had a expertise in certain things. And if they didn’t, I’d go ahead and then and say, Okay, I need you to become proficient in, let’s say, FDA. I need you to become proficient with dealing with agriculture or animals or this or that, we had to deal with a lot of things. You can narrow it if you’re in just one industry. My point is, is get your staff involved, and even if the part time went or whatever, and say, okay, and I also went so far is, if you your company is involved in multiple trade associations, I signed those and said, you know, you need to look at this. If you’re a small company, you only do you know, a few trade associations, again, assign those out whatever, and those are the ones that you need to Hey, what’s the agenda? What are the committees you need to look at? And go from there? I don’t know if that is any benefit to you. Is, I don’t know if you do those kinds of things, Bethany or what. Oh, I

Speaker 1 

absolutely, absolutely and get involved in those trade organizations. So, you know, look through many of them, and I’ll use icpa as one of the examples. But many of them have question and answer, type, ask, ask and answer things. Use them. Search, through the old, old questions. Because if you’ve got a question, somebody else had a question, the library is there. The reference documents are there. So use them. Get involved.

Andy  

Well, the other is now you’re getting up to speed on some things. One of the other objectives that I guess are responsibilities, in my opinion, is the import, export compliance group, or even the transportation or any department that you have, one of the things you should be looking at is, what is your regulatory and Government Affairs agenda type? Things could be legislative. It could be a regulation with a bureaucrat or department. It’s, it’s, you know, the government affairs, type things, industry affairs, what are the things that are pertinent to you? I always then looked and pulled the staff together and we would look at, you know, what are the things that are out there that we would like to have, trying to affect change on and so in that is that then I, as the leader, I would look at it and go, Okay, we need to pick our top three. And while there’s all these other things going I understand that, but these are the top three top priority, all resources are going to be put for this year to get these things. What do we gotta do to get them accomplished? And it could be that, you know, well, it’s gonna require a bill or a law to be created. Okay, that’s part of it. What do we gotta do? Who do we gotta talk to? And all that? And it’s not something that we’re gonna actually say we’re gonna get done. We’re gonna get it done through trade associations and affiliations on but the point being is, what’s your top three regulatory affairs issues? And then from there, you can do and other ad hoc things come up. But if those are your top regulatory and industry affairs type issues, maybe you only have one or two. That’s fine, but at least. You can that’s the focus throughout the year. And then you can communicate to your upper management and to the legal groups or whoever on here are the things that we need to be pushing forward. Now they may come back and go. We want you to also add XYZ issue. Okay, then they’ve added another issue for you. But the point being is they’re going to ask, turn around, ask you, what are our top issues if we are going to Washington or something like that. If you’ve got your list prepared, here’s the issue. And if something comes up, they can always say, Hey, if you talk to a senator or congressman, a staffer or anybody else, have them call me and I’ll follow up, but that way you’ve talked to them, planted the seed, and then they’ll hopefully get with you. What do you think about that? I

Speaker 1 

agree. And you know, it’s funny because top three, top three, you could say it in a different way too. Maybe an 8020, approach would be another way to say it. What do you want to spend your top amount of time working on what’s the most that you could affect and actually, actually affect that’s where you want to spend the most of your time on. So and I think a top three approach, and it doesn’t just, it just, doesn’t just come across when it comes to regulatory affairs. I think it also comes across anytime you’re in a position, in any position. Let’s say maybe I’m maybe I’m a brand new person coming into a brand new role. Where are the top three things I need to focus on? So I can even express to you what my top three things are. Have I, have I done a gap analysis, yet? Have I sat with some of my other staff members around my room. And, you know, have I sat with a logistics person, the guy who does shipping every day, day in, day out. This is all he does, is shipping. But maybe through sitting with him and shadowing his process, I might find that there’s a major gap here, and this is something that I need to push to my top three. Maybe he’s doing something that wastes time and then waste money. So, I mean, I think before you even get to your giant Regulatory Affairs part, you need to do a gap analysis and figure out your top three within your own personal business, your own company. Do do an at 20, figure it out on your own. Define

Andy  

gap again, your because it could mean several things. I know what you’re talking about, but it’s a gap analysis is what it’s like. Oh, great. I’m sitting here trying to work on classification. You’re talking about gap analysis, what it’s like. What are we talking about? Sounds

Speaker 1 

terrifying. Gap gap analysis, for me is the way that I would I would talk about it. Someone who’s never heard of a gap analysis before sit down and take one step back. I don’t know anything about anything. Pretend like you are absolutely brand new to the company, brand new to position, brand new to everything. Take all your preconceived notions completely out of it. Sit down and shadow the process A to Z. So maybe you need to sit first with your purchasing people and figure out from your purchasing people what is their process. Ask them questions. Don’t tell them what to do. Don’t tell them where they’re right or wrong. Ask them questions. Figure out what they are doing, and you have time later on to fix problems. Right now, you’re just trying to identify problems. So sit with your purchasing. From purchasing. You need to sit with customer service. Yeah, go ahead.

Andy  

Well, and on all of those, it’s, there’s a another thing is, the is map. Should map is? Another way to put it is map meaning is, like, you’re mapping the current process, regardless if you think it’s right or wrong or perfect, or like, Oh, we got to destroy this and start over what’s happening now. But to your point, ask them what they’re doing. Don’t try and flow chart everything. Just step one, you do this and step two, just do it as an outline, and then the flow charts can come later. However, to your point, sometimes when you’re asking, What are you doing? Ask the also the question, why do you do it that way? Or exactly you have to ask, I’ve always been told, you know, I’ve always, I’ve been told, we’ve always done it this way. Or, I don’t know, those are all right, okay. These are fallen tells me, yeah, it’s, it’s like, you know what? We need to do a good, a better job of communicating what’s going on. This is why it’s important, and selling them on the idea of following the procedures a certain way. But anyway, so ask the question. The point is, what are you doing? But why are you doing that? Too, at times,

Speaker 1 

why is the the number one I’ve I’ve learned in my life, there are two questions you can ask that will get you the best results. Number one, why are you doing it this way? Number two, how can I help you? Those are the two questions I found throughout my entire career that will allow you an open dialog with someone else to be able to affect that change Exactly.

Andy  

And one of the things that I would say is it’s always good to watch, and I would look at the process from start to finish, or however you want to do it. If you can’t really always do that, it’s okay. You know, you’ve got to have the ability to look at the entire process, start to finish, and know what part you’re dealing with and how it fits in there. Eventually that’ll all get flow chart, and that’s fine, and then you’ll see opportunities for improvement. But the other thing that I always suggest is also, you know, you see the process, and it’s like now start at the end of the process, when the customers are getting delivery, and work backwards, and you focus on the exceptions when a customer doesn’t get a timely delivery or the right delivery, and then you start working backwards and what happened. And then you know, if the accounts payable and accounts receivable both have challenges, the accounts payable, they can’t pay the bill, or when they’re paying the bill, they don’t know what department to put it, charge it to those kinds of things like, Well, okay, that means there’s certain accounting codes that have to be in there. Certain information may be missing. That’s like, okay, that’s an exception that most people don’t usually see. Could just

Speaker 1 

be customer service. Forgot to put a tax ID on something. Oh, yeah. And

Andy  

then the other is they needed it, or why the customer service also in the scope of this is that if there’s the right information in the order, and that may be the order system, it may not be somebody manually doing something wrong, it may be at the system, but regardless, as you look at it, the shipments delivered, or you’re able to after clearance, or whatever the case may be, you may be able to bill then, however, it’s not going out, because you’re not getting a an EDI message timely from your carrier, or whatever the case may be, and you back it all the way up. Here’s one of the challenges that I always give people. So let me ask you this Bethany, you’ve got, I’m sure, shipments that are coming in from factories and whatnot, you use the Harmonized Tariff numbers that are on the paperwork when it comes with the shipment ever, rarely, and I

almost never.

Andy  

And see that right there is where I look at it’s like, why not? Because, well, you can’t trust the vendors, right? Well, I have a problem with that. That goes back to your saving purchase what will it take for that information to be accurate so that when it goes through, you can accept it? And a lot of that time comes from when the purchase orders are issued and information is going through right then is where that harmonized everything. Well, you got to get your purchasing to say, hey, a part doesn’t just happen. Put this in there and things, but anyway.

Speaker 1 

Well, okay, so let me take it one step backwards. Trade compliance is the one single department that over arcs the entire company we could deal with finance one day, we could deal with HR in a different country. The next day, we could deal with shipping. The next day, you might deal with all of them all in the same day. But there are very In fact, I would challenge others to come up with one that that would be the same. I can’t think of another department in the company that has the opportunity to touch every single department at any point in time every single day. So why not use that to your advantage? So if, if trade compliance is ignoring one area completely, then yeah, you’re probably going to get some dumb, dumb HTS codes or HS codes on your shipping documents. And you know, they’re dumb, dumb because you don’t make widget B, you make widget A. So if, if I’m not making something in the automotive industry, why would I expect to see an automotive motive HS code on my on my documents? Well, because that shipper does make automotive parts, and maybe an electromechanical break could be for an automotive type situation, whereas I’m not using it for that type of scenario. So in my case, I don’t want to see the automotive Did I ever tell them that? No, then, of course, I expected them to put the wrong code on there. So trade compliance again, you touch every single other department every single day gives it to your advantage

Andy  

well, and to that point now, more than ever again, this is, is that probably, in the last three weeks, the compliance groups have are at the table again. What do you think? What’s the impact? What do we gotta so one of the things that I always caution people don’t react respond. So there’s a lot of times, all right, 25% duty rate on Canada and Mexico. Oh no. It’s like, okay, well, calm down. It’s actually a negotiating tool to try and get something else going on. I. I saw, not

Speaker 1 

only that, but walk in with ideas too. Sorry, I interrupt when I get excited, some ideas. Yes, there’s ways that you can, you don’t have to respond, even just as a response. I mean, we can have a call and response, but I can walk in and say, well, have we thought about first sale? Have we thought about drawback? Have you thought about reconciliation? Have you thought about, have you thought about, have you thought about, what about free trade agreements? What about this? And then we can have a changing

Andy  

your source on some it’s like, Why do you always, you know, going to China? Listen, a lot of people have changes because you always made it there. It’s like, you know what? There’s a lot of other Believe it or not, there’s a lot of technology manufacturers in Ireland, and most people don’t even realize that, and

Speaker 1 

they have the industry. They’ve got some great ones in

Andy  

the industry. I would look at sources around the world of that already have trade agreements. You mentioned that, you know Australia and

Speaker 1 

New Singapore, Korea, yeah, there’s so

Andy  

the UK the day. And some of us like, well, you know, but we’re trying to get, you know, cheap or inexpensive imports. And I’m like, I’m fine. Everybody wants inexpensive imports, but I don’t want them at the sacrifice of US exports, as I’m looking at that, those are the things that you just said. It is right on the money. When you’re going in and have the opportunity to your upper management, you may need to just sit there and listen, but have some ideas ahead of time, or listen to it and say, You know what, there’s a problem you just came up with or something, you know what? I’ll do some research and I’ll come back. Don’t jump out there to try and Bs your way to say, well, I’ll figure it out. If you don’t know that’s one thing, just say, You know what? I need research today.

Speaker 1 

There is nothing wrong with that answer. I’ll tell you that right now. It saved my butt a few times. So, you know, that’s funny, because being in compliance, there’s way too much information. It’s impossible for anyone to memorize any one of these single books that are on my empty bookshelf. Back here, normally, I have all my books on my bookshelf, but, but

Andy  

it’s so that’s, I know, I know

Speaker 1 

I’m renovating. No, it’s, it’s impossible to memorize it all. And you know, the thing about compliance is you need to know where to go to find the information. Not supposed to know the information. There are certain bits of information you have to know. But you need to know that something exists and where to go to read up more about it. You’re not supposed to memorize it. It would be, it would be like trying to fit everything into your little hat there. Andy, I know it’s a big hat, but no, there’s a there’s just too much. And that’s actually what I love the most about compliance too is there’s so much and it changes every day. So even if you did memorize it, it wouldn’t be the same as yesterday.

Andy  

Well, one of the things too is, how do you keep yourself sharp? I mean, as they old adage, I think iron sharpens iron. It’s one of those where, even with as busy as we are, too often we can just we keep ourselves so busy that we don’t stop for our our own self development, and it’s up to you if you need to develop skills or gain knowledge to become more proficient. But that network is developing a network of contacts, so you can even just pick up the phones, like, are you dealing with this or a sound board? Because you know there are people that you need to be able to talk to to say you just wouldn’t believe what I’m going through. And you can’t really do that with people within your own company. Sometimes, if they’re not in your little niche, they’re going like, I don’t know what you’re talking about.

Speaker 1 

They’re gonna look at you sideways. And why do you need to know? Well, okay, so I’ve got a two fold answer that. Number one is never stop asking questions. If you’ve already done your gap analysis, if you’re going A to Z, go Z to A, do it again. Do it again. Do it again, because you’re going to find something different every single time. And number two is go back to those resources we talked about at the very beginning. We talked about your network of people, your network of trade lawyers, getting on those newsletters, going to the seminars, going to, you know, even just to check out the website, compliance is also a very small field, believe it or not. It’s, it’s one of those, one of those types of fields where you could meet the same person at three different jobs, and that could be a good thing or a bad thing, depending on if they’re Andy or not. But you know, you could, you could meet the same person. You can bounce those ideas off of them. And really, even though we all make different products. We’re all in the same field. We’re all here for the same purpose and the same reason, and we’re all here to help each other, because every single one of us know exactly how hard it is to do our job on a day to day basis. So I know I can pick up the phone or shoot a text message or an email and say to about 10 different people, I could say, Hey guys, I’m really struggling with this one. Anybody got an idea and and to that, if you don’t know anybody yet, yet, to that point, get involved with some of these organizations, similar to NCB, FAA, icpa, there’s, there’s probably a World Trade Center in your local community, at least in the big, major, major communities. I know that I’m I’m up in the mountains of Fort Collins, Colorado, so I’m way up, kind of in middle of nowhere, but about an hour and a half south in Denver, there’s a World Trade Center that does monthly meetings, so go to their luncheons, um, ask questions on the sound boards. In fact, even something as simple as LinkedIn, there are LinkedIn groups. There’s Facebook groups for you know, trade compliance professionals join them.

Andy  

And there is a great podcast show that you ought to listen to.

Speaker 1 

There’s that one podcast show, I forgot the name of it, though I love it. You got to listen and learn, and you can never stop learning. If you find yourself becoming stagnant, that’s the point in time where you set an alarm clock and you take, you know, 10 minutes out of a very, very busy day, and you just go catch up on your news. Catch up on your stories. As my grandma would have said, catch up on your stories.

Andy  

Well, with that, it’s going to help you. I would say also, it would be wise to draft a an email at times, or some kind of communicate to your upper management and others, and and be that voice of reason. I mean, you know, the political winds can go both ways, but it’s like, hey, at the end of the day, your business has got to function. Hey, guys, don’t panic. You know what’s going on with the Panama Canal? Hey, we’ve got stuff coming from China that’s on a ship going through the Panama Canal. Is how’s that going to be affected? Well, if it’s destined to the US, that’s one thing. If it’s destined somewhere else, right? You got different things to think about. Look at alternatives to your supply chain. Work with all but all that to say is, with everything that’s going on. The other thing is, when there are issues that come up, case in point, all right, the hoodies were, and still are bit of an issue, but not as much right now. But the hoodies are, were attacking cargo ships in the Red Sea, right? And so the net effect of that was, what your cycle times went dramatically up. If you’re using a carrier, that instead of going through the Red Sea, they had to go all the way around the Cape of Africa and come up, okay, that additional transportation cost because they added for yield. But here’s the other question, what opportunities does that create? Most people going, Oh man, this is slowing up. My, my, my shipment, because it’s on a ship to going halfway around the world and all this, yeah, but now, well, and the other I was just going to say, though, is, what about those countries like South Africa, Namibia, which is just sort north of South Africa, and some of those along there cargo ships coming around, they’re going to be doing Tech Stops. They’re going to be, you know, an increase in frequency of and goods coming out of those countries and all that. Well, maybe there’s an opportunity there to change sources, and if there’s enough business, they’ll keep that frequency going. But the point being is, okay, you got a problem in one part of the world, but it may create an opportunity in another part,

Speaker 1 

absolutely. And on that note, you hit it a minute ago. On that note, you may not recognize every opportunity right away, because you may not be as tuned in to a certain facet of the supply chain as someone else’s. You hit it a minute ago. Andy, what about doing your own internal newsletter? I do this monthly for our global company. And I’ll take some of the stuff that we get from all these different trade lawyers or, you know, groups or whatnot, and I’ll take the ones that apply to the products, the type of products that we manufacture, the type of situations we find ourselves in, and I’ll redact some of those, you know, news blast. And I will put something together monthly that says, hey, you know, these are the articles this year, this month that I think that you might want to see or be a part of. I can also use that as a training tool. So maybe I’ll think somebody needs a refresher on Incoterms, for example. Well, you know what? Here? I’m going to use my newsletter as a refresher on Incoterms and put a short article in there. You break it up into snippets, and you’re also educating everyone else in your group and giving them opportunities to say, Hey, I saw that opportunity in South Africa or wherever it was. Do you think we could maybe potentially source here instead? And then maybe, who knows, depending on the industry, maybe A, G, O, A is something you can take advantage of. So it allows you to bring up conversations that you may not have been able to have before,

Andy  

because you have become a resource. You yourself become a resource for upper management. Nice job security. Well, it is, and it’s one of those, listen, anybody can do what I call a hit and run, communicate. You can draft up something. Here you go, send it out. All right? The issue there, and the challenge is, how do you do this consistently? That’s the big thing, if you are providing even just a short little snippet, not much to report on the international trade side. But here’s this, or, Hey, listen, if any are you of you are going to be traveling to Washington, DC, or to something, some, let me know. I’ll give you a back pocket. I used to call it a back pocket list. I’m sorry, back pocket list absolutely all right, and that’s where, just so people know is, you can imagine, in my FedEx days, civil logistics days, I was with the US council for international business. Was with Boomerang Carnes and all. And so we would go through and I’d have a list, nobody can remember all these things, so I’d have a very short back pocket list that I would provide to executives. If you are traveling, that’s the upper management you’re not going with them. If they are traveling, you run into somebody from the FDA or agriculture, from this Congress pull out there. So to say, oh, you know what? There was something. Let me look at, okay, hey, and it’s whatever one issue is, is that on the FDA, you know, you were looking at reclassifying some of the medical devices, it’s going to affect our issue. You know, there’s something there we I need your support on that. Would you mind calling my compliance person, whatever, and you give them the name and number, and they go from there. So, yeah, okay, great. Or, or, do you mind if I have my compliance person reach out to you? That’s either way. It’s same thing with the, you know, this bill. Maybe come through, whatever, whatever the issue is, you can have a list. This is what we need, and this is you just keep it really short and simple. I guarantee I have had more executives come back to me and say that they were very appreciative of the list, but it made them look like a hero, because it made them gave them a short thing, that they are more on top of things. Nobody expects them to have the minutia detail. That’s what our job is for. Give them a little bit. They can tap the seed and, man, it opens the door for you, exactly.

Speaker 1 

I could not agree more.

Andy  

Listen, let’s wrap this up. We need to look at, I mean, you and I could keep talking, there’s

Speaker 1 

might need to have a part two one of these days. Yeah.

Andy  

Well, it’s, it’s like, okay, so if you’re new to the area and all that these things I’ve given you is kind of like a building, a foundation to stand on to for your career and everything else, that’s fine. The other would be more advanced of, how do you get in and keep up to speed with the more advanced topics, and climb up the chain a little bit, and that networking comes into play, right big time.

Speaker 1 

I think we could talk forever on it.

Andy  

Well, Bethany, you are a pleasure. I hope to see it. Some conference coming up. I know that for sure, I’ll be going to the icpa in Dallas in the fall. There’s icpa Coming up in Orlando. There are AI conferences Canada, one coming up too, another kind of, yeah. And actually, I just came back from Canada in November. So I was up there, chilly there right now. Ie Canada, and there’s great band those some great people. I got to see some folks I hadn’t seen in a long time. And, oh, it’s just fantastic. So anyway, to see at

the next one, how’s that? I

Andy  

love it. I love it. Folks, we are so appreciative again of your listenership. Please like us, share us, subscribe, follow us, all those kinds of wonderful things. Bethany, you are such a pleasure. Golly, it’s just great to get to talk to you. It’s been a while since we’ve actually been able to talk so appreciate. I’m looking

Speaker 1 

forward to the next time too. So I appreciate your time. Thanks for letting. Me spitball with you here, you bet

Andy  

Y’all have a great day. You.